Brian Cowen is a republican, not a socialist, and has no burning ambition to be Taoiseach, he tells Mark Brennock, Chief Political Correspondent in an exclusive interview.
You can see why they love him in Fianna Fáil. He fights their corner in public, reserving particular venom for those critics who see Fianna Fáilers as having some form of original sin which makes them politically impure.
He did it in this interview, regularly sticking the boot into the Opposition, even when not apparently provoked. He brought up Fianna Fáil's old favourites, such as the year Proinsias de Rossa increased the old age pension by just €1.83, and Fine Gael's 2002 election promises to taxi drivers and Eircom shareholders. He says he is looking forward to seeing the economic policies put forward at the next election by the Green Party and Sinn Féin, implying they will be a great laugh altogether.
His appointment in September to replace Charlie McCreevy as Minister for Finance was seen as the single most important move in the Government's attempt to redefine its image. It was clear from when Mr McCreevy's departure to Europe was announced in July that Mr Cowen was to succeed him.
At the time Fianna Fáil figures drew attention to this change as the one that would cast off the "right wing" label and bring in a new caring, listening approach. The line was that McCreevy was a deeply ideological politician with determination to implement his own ideas, but Cowen was a Fianna Fáil pragmatist and would be at one with the Taoiseach in implementing the new project.
Mr Cowen initially professed not to recognise this depiction of what had happened. Told that Fianna Fáil figures had sought to portray it as such he said: "How it's portrayed to you is not for me to say."
However, two recurring themes are his feeling that the Government has been unfairly cast as uncaring, and that Fianna Fáil is wrongly portrayed as a party of pulling strokes with no concern for the common good. "The fact that we were being wrongly portrayed is something we had to rectify", he said.
He drew attention to the aspects of the Budget the Government has been keen to highlight. They had taken more people out of the tax net this year, introduced a major disability funding package, and improved social welfare provision. He quoted the ESRI's recent statement that "the big winners in the budget are those on low pay and social welfare", noting that the ESRI has often disagreed with the Government.
The dramatic fall in Government support since the 2002 election was due to deliberate misrepresentation of what it was doing, rather than to any breaking of promises, he says.
"In the immediate aftermath of the election an Opposition who were very upset at not having won the election decided to totally misrepresent the Government position." So he suggests that the Government, post the 2002 election, was not frantically reining in spending it had let out of control before the election, but was cleverly steering the economy through an international downturn.
Broken promises? "The people who were pouring on the promises without reference to costings or anything else were the Opposition parties. We remember what the Telecom [shareholders] were told, we remember what the taxi men were told. It was the Opposition that made those sort of crazy promises." The Government had not broken promises. It had simply "made corrections half way through the year" to ensure budgetary targets were met.
"Now we have come through the international downturn of the past two or three years. The Government deserves credit for having brought the economy through this period so well."
The perception of broken promises emerged because the Government was "totally fatigued" in the aftermath of the election. This had allowed the Opposition to decide "in their wrath at not having succeeded in getting us out", to portray the Government as having not been straight with the people.
So what about his and his party's broad philosophical outlook, and the Taoiseach's embrace of socialism? He says that those right-of-centre, left-of-centre, and liberal labels used throughout Europe and elsewhere don't apply here at all. "I think there are people trying to superimpose this idea of right and left on Irish politics probably since independence. We are different to the extent that we are a small country which hasn't inherited ideas of class, who were trying to build a Republic which would give opportunities to everyone regardless of their background."
In relation to Fianna Fáil's politics, he says they are the authors of social partnership; they restructured the economy to deal with crippling debt, reduced taxes to encourage job creation. "This effort to portray my party as being outside the mainstream - as being right of this or left of that or whatever you want to call it - the social partnership framework makes that a rather nonsensical analysis."
So keen is he to dismiss the idea that he holds to one of these foreign political philosophies that he won't even be drawn on whether he would be more at home in a Fianna Fáil/PD Government or a Fianna Fáil/Labour Government. "I'll just talk about my own party and the Government programme we negotiated." Has he any preference? "The people will decide what government they want."
Unlike the Taoiseach he wouldn't describe himself as a socialist, but is "a republican". Mr Ahern's claim of socialism was, however, "totally consistent with what our performance has been in Government. We are the people who brought in the welfare state in this country."
He had no problem with the Taoiseach's self description "because he is simply reflecting a Lemassian urban Fianna Fáil tradition in this city [Dublin] which has a lot to be proud of and which has done far more than those who would advocate that theirs is the preserve of socialism".
He raises the announcement by the Fine Gael and Labour Party leaders in Mullingar this year of their determination to agree a pre-election pact.
"When people want to talk about alternatives or prospect governments, they need to look to see is there a coherent policy alternative", he says. "It's not a numerical arithmetic formula. Politics isn't about getting whatever 84 you can conveniently to elect a Taoiseach and suddenly you will have a decent government. There has to be a basic coherence in policy terms."
Those who know Brian Cowen say that the public image of him is unfair. They say the rough diamond who sometimes shows up on the airwaves is not the sociable and courteous man they know privately.
Mr Cowen questions whether he comes across as this party bruiser figure. "I think people who say that about me aren't that well disposed to me or my politics anyway. There have been times when perhaps my performances could have been better. Overall I would have to say that I like competition of ideas, I like people being put on their mettle, being asked what's the basis for what they are saying.
"The other thing where perhaps I am seen by some as too combative is that I often see the subtext of some of the questions is why am I not apologising for being a Fianna Fáil man, and would I not rid myself of whatever original sin I am supposed to have. I react to that adversely. The stereotype is that Fianna Fáil has no real interest in the public, is not supporting the common good, and is all about strokes and all this old nonsense."
Does he want to be Taoiseach? "Its not a burning ambition", he says. "I am the deputy leader of the party. I am Minister for Finance, I have a lot of work ahead both organisationally and in Government." The Taoiseach has been there for ten years and can stay on "for as long as he likes", says Mr Cowen.
"The other reason why I don't get up wondering about that question every morning is because my father died suddenly at 51. I forgot about making long term plans when something like that hits you. In other words I don't look at life like that, I don't plan it out that way, we will see what happens in the future. It may wellbe I will be gone voluntarily or involuntarily by then."