Barr Tribunal: The theory that Mr John Carthy was attempting to commit "suicide by cop" when he left his house carrying a loaded gun, was put before the Barr tribunal yesterday.
Mr Carthy's behaviour during the armed stand-off with gardaí and his actions after leaving the house indicated that he had "a wish to be shot", counsel for the Garda, Mr John Rogers, said.
"Given this man put his mother out of the house and said goodbye to her, that he had said to Alice Farrell that the party was over and there would be no more laughing, given that he came out armed in the way he did to confront the gardaí, it must in fact be conjectured that John in fact intended that he should die."
In the hours leading up to Mr Carthy's death he had become increasingly agitated, Mr Rogers said. He had broken furniture, using the butt of his gun and had started to pace the room looking at his watch.
At some time between 3.20 p.m. and 4.30 p.m. on the day he was killed, he called the gardaí cowards and challenged them, saying: "Are you still there, f*** off out of here, you Free State bastards, shoot me, shoot me", Mr Rogers said.
Tribunal witness, Assistant Commissioner Tony Hickey, agreed that it had to be considered that Mr Carthy "had in his mind the likely consequences" when he left the house.
"It is one of the imponderables but it certainly begs the question, did he invite this?"
Mr Hickey said he was aware of the phenomenon of "suicide by cop", documented in the US, where victims precipitated their own deaths.
Mr Rogers said that there were three common characteristics of suicide by cop or victim-precipitated suicide: demands to be killed, imposing a deadline on the situation and refusal to negotiate. Mr Carthy was exhibiting all three, he contended.
"Perhaps this is an element heretofore not fully explored because of the degree of sensitivity attached to persons wanting to take their own lives," Mr Rogers said.
Mr Paul Greene, counsel for Ms Rose Carthy and Ms Marie Carthy, said while Mr Carthy's state of mind on leaving the house was "a matter of conjecture", independent evidence of his thinking was contained in the statement of Mr Kevin Ireland.
Mr Carthy had telephoned Mr Ireland earlier in the day and told him he had been looking for a solicitor.
In his statement, Mr Ireland said he asked Mr Carthy not to do harm to himself or others and he replied, "I haven't a notion of it, I'm just shooting in the air and at the walls to keep them away from the house."
He also told Mr Ireland that he would not give himself up unless he got a solicitor and he complained that his "own family" had not got him one.
The Carthys were not told he had looked for a solicitor.
This phone call was "the only evidence available to us of John Carthy engaging with someone other than the gardaí," Mr Greene said.
Taking the stand in the afternoon, the officer responsible for the deployment of the ERU told the tribunal how he had visited the scene at Abbeylara days after the shooting.
Det Supt Patrick Hogan said he drove to the Carthy house four days after the killing, in the company of ERU officers.
The purpose of the visit was to assess the layout of the scene, but he did not enter on the Carthy premises.
The visit lasted 10 to 15 minutes, Supt Hogan said.
